When I read your story originally I remember that I had mixed feelings. But lately I’ve been reading some of the lies that RMS haters tell about him and his views on sex. Reading his blog posts changed my mind about some things and now I’ve realised that you were right and that RMS has a similar opinion.
Richard Stallman was criticised for saying that it’s normal for teenagers (Stallman defines them as people that are at least 14 years old) to have sex with adults. He believes that the laws that call sex with children or teenagers “rape” are dishonest and that the definition of rape shouldn’t depend on someone’s age. His haters criticised him for that too, but your story shows how crazy such laws are.
When he made that statement about pedophilia, I think he was just trying to extend the rights that teenagers normally have onto children (Stallman defines them as people that are 13 years old or younger). I think that he meant well and he really didn’t realise that pedophilia is harmful.
Still, if he’s talking about cases like mine, yes, I can get onboard with that. But with an age gap of 10+ years, no, I really can’t.
I’ve been thinking about the age gap argument and that’s also something his haters like to point out. I think Stallman doesn’t believe that an age gap itself is wrong. So I’m curious why do you think it’s wrong? I couldn’t think of a logical reason and I realised that I’m unable to define what the acceptable age gap should be. Because as you pointed out, big age gaps seem weird even when both people are adults:
My mom was almost 20 years younger than my dad m, but she was 27 and he was 46. That may seem weird, but both of them are adults.
This is unusual, but it’s not wrong. So why would big age gaps be wrong for a teenager and an adult? After all we accept that teenagers should be able to have control over their own bodies (at least in most of Europe and most of US). So shouldn’t it be their decision?
Sorry for posting such a long comment on an old post. I just realised how insane the whole hate campaign against RMS was, because he is right about most of the things he was criticised for.
Most teenagers are too young at 14 to know how the consequneces of their actions might reverbirate in their lives. Sure, they might feel up to the task, but ask any saman of any tribe, 18, 19 is the age when you actually get to be called an adult. Yes, they still lack eperience, by they make up for it by having youth. You put tyem in risky situations so they learn. Old people aren’t wiser, they just have more life experience.
So, my conclusion would be, 14 is too young (in general, doesn’t mean there aren’t 14 year olds thinking like 20 year olds). 16… depends, but with proper guidnace, a lot better than 14. So… yeah, I would be willing to lower the bar, IF parrenting wasn’t seen as a role, but as a duty (this is a diffeent converstaion).
This is unusual, but it’s not wrong. So why would big age gaps be wrong for a teenager and an adult?
The reasons I explained above: not enough life experience.
After all we accept that teenagers should be able to have control over their own bodies (at least in most of Europe and most of US). So shouldn’t it be their decision?
That “control” is mostly imaginary (as it should be), They THINK they’re in control, but when pushing comes to shoving, they always call the parrents (again, as it should be). There is nothing wrong with that, their parrents know them best (or at least how things should be) and they probably know why they did what they did (again, in this world, this is a best case scenario… these things should be REALLY, realy analyzed by people far smarter than me). So, the assumption is, shit happened, they’re young, they can lie out of spite, which makes thigs even harder… let’s find out what happened 🤷.
Sorry for posting such a long comment on an old post. I just realised how insane the whole hate campaign against RMS was, because he is right about most of the things he was criticised fo
As I said, I would agree about SOME of the things (I would call them sane defaults) he said, but not everything. 14 is too young in most cases. 16… I could probably start debating in that.
Thanks for the answer. So it’s not really about the age gap itself? You just think that the age of consent should be 16 or higher? Or is it both?
14 is too young in most cases. 16… I could probably start debating in that.
Is it possible that you are thinking that, because age of consent is very high in your country? I imagine that people who live for example in Germany, where age of consent is 14, might not think the same. In most of Europe it’s 14-16. In some countries teenagers can even get an abortion.
16 or higher, yes. But, the age gap shouldn’t be too big at that age as well. My personal opinion, 10 years at that age, max. Anything above 25, add whatever age gap you wan’t, they are adults in the true meaning of the word.
Is it possible that you are thinking that, because age of consent is very high in your country?
Hm… maybe. After all, I was raised that way.
But still, I’ve seen how much teenagers at that age have going on up there, they’re just thrill seekers at that age, they really don’t know anything about life, they could easilly be fooled by someone older than them.
You are right about teenagers, but on the other hand not all people are the same. For some reason we’ve decided that they are competent to make those kinds of decisions and to do other things like driving a car. So even though they are not adults, we don’t think of them as children either. There is probably no simple answer to this question, though.
The age of consent is 16 in most places. Like half of Europe, half of the US states.
RMS wasn’t talking about 16/17 year olds.
There’s very obviously not anything wrong with a 17 year old having sex with a 16 year old.
I was 19, she was 17.
Still, if he’s talking about cases like mine, yes, I can get onboard with that. But with an age gap of 10+ years, no, I really can’t.
My mom was almost 20 years younger than my dad m, but she was 27 and he was 46. That may seem weird, but both of them are adults.
When I read your story originally I remember that I had mixed feelings. But lately I’ve been reading some of the lies that RMS haters tell about him and his views on sex. Reading his blog posts changed my mind about some things and now I’ve realised that you were right and that RMS has a similar opinion.
Richard Stallman was criticised for saying that it’s normal for teenagers (Stallman defines them as people that are at least 14 years old) to have sex with adults. He believes that the laws that call sex with children or teenagers “rape” are dishonest and that the definition of rape shouldn’t depend on someone’s age. His haters criticised him for that too, but your story shows how crazy such laws are.
When he made that statement about pedophilia, I think he was just trying to extend the rights that teenagers normally have onto children (Stallman defines them as people that are 13 years old or younger). I think that he meant well and he really didn’t realise that pedophilia is harmful.
I’ve been thinking about the age gap argument and that’s also something his haters like to point out. I think Stallman doesn’t believe that an age gap itself is wrong. So I’m curious why do you think it’s wrong? I couldn’t think of a logical reason and I realised that I’m unable to define what the acceptable age gap should be. Because as you pointed out, big age gaps seem weird even when both people are adults:
This is unusual, but it’s not wrong. So why would big age gaps be wrong for a teenager and an adult? After all we accept that teenagers should be able to have control over their own bodies (at least in most of Europe and most of US). So shouldn’t it be their decision?
Sorry for posting such a long comment on an old post. I just realised how insane the whole hate campaign against RMS was, because he is right about most of the things he was criticised for.
Most teenagers are too young at 14 to know how the consequneces of their actions might reverbirate in their lives. Sure, they might feel up to the task, but ask any saman of any tribe, 18, 19 is the age when you actually get to be called an adult. Yes, they still lack eperience, by they make up for it by having youth. You put tyem in risky situations so they learn. Old people aren’t wiser, they just have more life experience.
So, my conclusion would be, 14 is too young (in general, doesn’t mean there aren’t 14 year olds thinking like 20 year olds). 16… depends, but with proper guidnace, a lot better than 14. So… yeah, I would be willing to lower the bar, IF parrenting wasn’t seen as a role, but as a duty (this is a diffeent converstaion).
The reasons I explained above: not enough life experience.
That “control” is mostly imaginary (as it should be), They THINK they’re in control, but when pushing comes to shoving, they always call the parrents (again, as it should be). There is nothing wrong with that, their parrents know them best (or at least how things should be) and they probably know why they did what they did (again, in this world, this is a best case scenario… these things should be REALLY, realy analyzed by people far smarter than me). So, the assumption is, shit happened, they’re young, they can lie out of spite, which makes thigs even harder… let’s find out what happened 🤷.
As I said, I would agree about SOME of the things (I would call them sane defaults) he said, but not everything. 14 is too young in most cases. 16… I could probably start debating in that.
Thanks for the answer. So it’s not really about the age gap itself? You just think that the age of consent should be 16 or higher? Or is it both?
Is it possible that you are thinking that, because age of consent is very high in your country? I imagine that people who live for example in Germany, where age of consent is 14, might not think the same. In most of Europe it’s 14-16. In some countries teenagers can even get an abortion.
16 or higher, yes. But, the age gap shouldn’t be too big at that age as well. My personal opinion, 10 years at that age, max. Anything above 25, add whatever age gap you wan’t, they are adults in the true meaning of the word.
Hm… maybe. After all, I was raised that way.
But still, I’ve seen how much teenagers at that age have going on up there, they’re just thrill seekers at that age, they really don’t know anything about life, they could easilly be fooled by someone older than them.
You are right about teenagers, but on the other hand not all people are the same. For some reason we’ve decided that they are competent to make those kinds of decisions and to do other things like driving a car. So even though they are not adults, we don’t think of them as children either. There is probably no simple answer to this question, though.