I’d say “Doomer” is the perfect term to describe the assholes who think “Politics don’t affect me personally, so why should I even consider?” or “Both sides are crap, choosing is just chickening out”.

You know the kind of pessimistic irascible assholes you find on Twitter or 4Chan or even Kiwi Farms who doesn’t care what you want to express online.

    • BooBees@fedinsfw.app
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      6 hours ago

      Or captive. Or ignorant. You can be captive to a cult, or domineering person, or just so ignorant or intellectually challenged you literally don’t know these ideas exist in their proper context and why.

  • otp@sh.itjust.works
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    5 hours ago

    Probably some flavour of anti-woke.

    You described people who are anti-woke and the question is whether they’re also anti-anti-woke.

  • palordrolap@fedia.io
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    5 hours ago

    Curmudgeon, perhaps. Or at least curmudgeonly.

    Or choose from something here: https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/curmudgeon

    Among those, “crank” stands out. This is usually someone who holds a (often provably) wrong, unconventional or unpopular opinion and insists that their way is the right way and that everyone else is wrong.

    Cranks can be right, which a crank will hold onto dearly and use in their arguments, even if the considerable majority of cranks turn out to have been wrong.

    On the other hand, cranks tend to beat their metaphorical drum a lot more than someone who simply refuses to pick a side and keeps their trap shut.

  • funkless_eck@sh.itjust.works
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    6 hours ago

    To have a dispassionate conversation about it - they aren’t perfect antonyms. The woke movement and the antiwoke movement don’t oppose precisely the same things and neither of them have a definitive definition any longer, mostly due to the overuse of the terms over a long time.

    For example people will use anti-woke unironically but you rarely see anyone use woke genuinely and with passion any more. Infact anyone who does would seem dated and ridiculous now to seriously request without irony to consider being woke.

  • Ariselas@piefed.ca
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    4 hours ago

    I guess it depends on the scope of your question.

    Woke, inclusivity, and all that stuff mean nothing if it is not backed up by actions, people can say all the right things and still be assholes, just as someone can live their life and do what they can to help others without ever getting political or having the theory or words to back it up.

    I grew up as a late Xer, on the cusp of the Oregon Trail generation, George Carlin’s “don’t vote it only encourages them” made a lot of sense at the time when the choice seemed to be Neo-Liberalism or Conservative. We also saw our Boomer parents 70s activism turn to 80s greed and excess, so the tune out, do drugs grunge, goth, rave, and emo eras made sense.

    I think it’s naive not to be somewhat cynical when every corporation puts out rainbow flags during Pride Week / month, and then do nothing the rest of the year, or when police decide they want to march in Pride Parades.

    I think people also get caught up in false equivalents, that just because there is shit on one side, it doesn’t mean that the whole is shit. The side that is not as inclusive as it could be or might have some hateful members, but is overall will to learn and adapt, is not the same as the side that is hateful at its core. For example, I don’t understand TERFs, in some ways people that get called TERFs have done important work for the feminist movement, I believe some are coming from a position of misunderstanding. However, there are some on the right who have jumped on trans exclusion and call themselves feminists, which serves the right to sow divisions or the appearance of division within the left or those working towards inclusion.

  • BananaTrifleViolin@lemmy.world
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    6 hours ago

    Well you may wish to dismiss them, but its not unreasonable position for someone to take. Some people may genuinely believe the woke / anti woke argument is an irrelevance and distracting from more important issues. In fact that nay be the whole point - a distraction from the rest of the mess.

    Similarly in the US, saying both sides are crap and disengaging reflects the state of the US political system. Two parties have corrupted the system in their favour for decades. Its a nonsense to believe politics fits neatly into one camp or the other. And its a nonsense to say everyone must choose one or the other or they’re in the wrong.

    When your only option in an election is voting for whichever party is the lesser evil, its no longer a democracy. And its unsurprising that people dont want to waste time talking about the non-choice.

    • 🇨🇦GreenBeard🇨🇦@lemmy.ca
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      3 hours ago

      The only way you believe that is how it works, is if you’re already buying into the framing of the “Anti-Woke”, “Anti-Empathy”, Anti-human. You’re imagining a world where it all begins and ends in Republican or Democrat.

      I want you to think real hard. Most Democrats, can’t stand each other. There’s like half a dozen different factions, and the only thing that they all agree on, is we should probably not intentionally destroy our lives, homes, and futures, condemn our children to die and ultimately wipe humanity off the face of the Earth. We’re stuck, working with a bunch of idiots who keep undermining every positive thing we try to do, and I will stand with you always to oppose them someday. But right now, we have a bigger problem. Because this isn’t a fight between right and wrong. This is a fight between “Right, Wrong, Good, Bad, and Ugly” vs “The End of Everything”.

      You’re right, Democrats aren’t a solution. They’re a stop-gap. They’re a play for time and we have to come up with a better answer in the meantime, because they will fail. Their true policy is they have no real policy because they are such a big tent they have no coherent message. They’re just opposed to ending everything.

      So yeah, if you take the Republican framing of this being a clash of two principled, moral, coherent world views, it seems reasonable to say neither of them seem to fix anything. It’s not though. It’s the chaotic mess of everything that might be on one side, vs endless silence on the other.

    • Ariselas@piefed.ca
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      4 hours ago

      I think in a lot of ways it’s the right that has made identity political and it works for them really really well especially in a binary political system. The right wing only has to be 1 thing to 1 group of people, while there are 100s of left wings and intersections.