Guess what. Not working hard had even worse outcomes. I’m kind of scared for the future with so many Gen Z being huge slackers and emotional weaklings.
A willingness to work is the least important factor to success. To be successful, a motivation to work is insufficient. In fact, too much of a motivation to work is as detrimental to your career as a complete lack of motivation.
Overly hard workers don’t get rewarded, they get exploited. Too much productivity will actually block your advancement. And, let’s be honest, it’s not actually possible to get a promotion at most companies. Companies hire externally; they don’t like promoting internally as MBA schools teach this causes drama.
The key to success is to calibrate your work to your circumstance. Do you work for yourself, keep all the fruits of your labor, and actually earn more money when you take on additional clients? If you’re a self-employed consultant or something, then sure, harder work is directly rewarded. Work as much as you like. Are you a salaried employee whose company offers no formal bonus structure in writing and is completely capable of stringing you along with endless vague promises of bonuses that will never materialize? If that’s your situation, then working too hard is financially irresponsible. Even if all you care for is career advancement, then you should be doing just the bare minimum required to not get fired. Instead of working overtime that will never be paid for or recognized, use that extra time to work on your own projects or take on a side hustle.
Companies don’t promote from within. No company ever wants to agree to a firm written raise and bonus structure for their salaried workers (thus they have no accountability.) Hard work is not rewarded; it’s simply exploited. In modern office jobs, grinding is the path to failure, not the path to success. The path to success is working the minimum not to get fired, working on side projects in lieu of overtime, and job-hopping every few years to get the raises you won’t get any other way.
I’ll tell you what what! Theys gene Z should break their backs in the mines just like I did and my pappy did! Then master let’s you lynch ******* and that’s what life is all about, I’ll tell you!
There’s a big difference between working hard to get ahead and what you’re babbling about. I get the feeling from here that young people feel that harder workers shouldn’t be rewarded and slackers should earn the same.
No. They’re pointing out that hard work doesn’t make you exceptional, doesn’t get you rewarded and doesn’t get you ahead.
Since you apparently haven’t actually been working for the past fifteen years, the social contract has been almost entirely broken. Busting your arse gets you the same pay as the dude who takes four hour smoke breaks and a shittier quality of life due to stress.
Workers are just refusing to be exploited
Yeah there may be some smaller companies that recognise and recompense great work, but they are the exception, not the rule. And they are increasingly unicorns.
Retired a few back but keep in touch with the higher ups as well. You’re completely wrong with that statement. Many people get rewarded for hard work. But in order to get rewarded, do you have to be the one that is seriously helping the company. If you’re talking about the bottom of the worker pile then you have to do something to stand out. In my case I started off building on the factory line. Saw what they ran for computer systems. Trained myself at my own expense to learn them and ingrain to myself Socially with the people that ran them. Hard work isn’t just the physical part. It’s also the mental part and most importantly the social part. So much of business is social and if they don’t know who you are they’ll never know the hard work you’re doing or how beneficial you are to the company. If you are, that is.
I’m actually still in the workforce, so I’m gonna go ahead and consider myself to be a bit more of an authority as to what’s going on than you are, seeing as you’ve just admitted you’re divorced from the working reality.
This thread is literally full of people telling you how they have brought value - in some cases, immense, company-saving value - and not been recompensed. I very freely admitted there were some companies that did still value workers. I also said they are no longer the norm. This is a continuation of a trend that started in the 90’s when outsourcing started chewing on the arses of the white collar workers, workforces became seen as dispensable and replaceable and it has sharply increased with the sociopathy of MBAs who can’t see any further than their own personal golden parachutes.
You gained your leg up in within a business framework that no longer exists. Demanding that workers continue to play by rules their employers ignore is lunacy.
Perfect example of the defeatist attitude. Btw it’s not an ancient system. Didn’t even exist in my grandparents time. Neither did the concept of a weekend.
You guys are the majority now. Make the changes you want.
Those 2 generations fight to get that. I remember cars being burned and flipped during strikes when I was young. This generation needs to do the same. Now when people go on strike everybody hates on them. Our grandparents put their lives on the line to get pensions, weekend, overtime pay etc etc. People now are letting it all slip away. Time to stop blaming the ones that got it and start blaming the ones letting it go.
That is so very far away from the actual expressed sentiment that I’m genuinely concerned that your underlying expectations of people and the world, completely hinders your ability to see reality at all.
Oh I see reality. I also see this next gen of workers coming in who are nothing like Gen X or even millennials. My underlying expectations are if you’re hired by someone be a good worker, work hard. Try to make the company better and if you’re good at it, the company will see this and promote you. Nothing crazy and nothing out of the reality that I experienced during my working life. Now I do see some new workers with the required social skills and knowledge to zoom up the ladder pretty quick, but that’s definitely not the norm.
This is not how the US workforce works at all- unless you are a boomer in a “retirement” job working 10hrs a week, getting paid for 40hrs, and relying on the younger generations to do all the work for you.
Just remember those younger people who show promise actually hate you because they already do your job better than you and will never be compensated for it.
Some of them are already past me and making more. But the majority flounder and don’t last. They most definitely aren’t doing my job better than me since they had to hire 4 when I retired. 3 of them didn’t make it and have been replaced. IT security guy in case you were wondering.
I think you got to spend too much online if this is the mental attitude you have. There’s tons of opportunity and good jobs and unemployment is crazy low right now. Like I said, get yourself a skill or a trade and there’s a shit pile of money to be made and as much work as you’re willing to do. I mean it took me and most of my friends into our forties to really accumulate anything, but I feel like the people on here think they should be rich or that every boomer was rich in their thirties. That’s very bizarre and a big disconnect from the reality that it actually was for many
So have I. Every move has been to something that I was assured would have great pay. My current job has taken me the furthest after several promotions. It’s still not paying enough to do what I want. I’m too old to start at the bottom again on another false promise.
The trick is to stay in the middle like 2/3s of the pack performance wise and pick things that are highly visible to management but also not too much of a pain in the ass to “save the day” on often enough that you’re seen as reliable.
Guess what. Not working hard had even worse outcomes. I’m kind of scared for the future with so many Gen Z being huge slackers and emotional weaklings.
Genx here:
Stop gobbling the boot.
Also Gen x
Work hard for what?
Look at the stories here.
Not everyone gets ownership, stock in a startup or something miraculous. And I’m older than Gen Z; I dunno how they even grew up sane.
You don’t need any of that to be successful. You just need a skill that pays and a willingness to work.
A willingness to work is the least important factor to success. To be successful, a motivation to work is insufficient. In fact, too much of a motivation to work is as detrimental to your career as a complete lack of motivation.
Overly hard workers don’t get rewarded, they get exploited. Too much productivity will actually block your advancement. And, let’s be honest, it’s not actually possible to get a promotion at most companies. Companies hire externally; they don’t like promoting internally as MBA schools teach this causes drama.
The key to success is to calibrate your work to your circumstance. Do you work for yourself, keep all the fruits of your labor, and actually earn more money when you take on additional clients? If you’re a self-employed consultant or something, then sure, harder work is directly rewarded. Work as much as you like. Are you a salaried employee whose company offers no formal bonus structure in writing and is completely capable of stringing you along with endless vague promises of bonuses that will never materialize? If that’s your situation, then working too hard is financially irresponsible. Even if all you care for is career advancement, then you should be doing just the bare minimum required to not get fired. Instead of working overtime that will never be paid for or recognized, use that extra time to work on your own projects or take on a side hustle.
Companies don’t promote from within. No company ever wants to agree to a firm written raise and bonus structure for their salaried workers (thus they have no accountability.) Hard work is not rewarded; it’s simply exploited. In modern office jobs, grinding is the path to failure, not the path to success. The path to success is working the minimum not to get fired, working on side projects in lieu of overtime, and job-hopping every few years to get the raises you won’t get any other way.
I’ll tell you what what! Theys gene Z should break their backs in the mines just like I did and my pappy did! Then master let’s you lynch ******* and that’s what life is all about, I’ll tell you!
There’s a big difference between working hard to get ahead and what you’re babbling about. I get the feeling from here that young people feel that harder workers shouldn’t be rewarded and slackers should earn the same.
No. They’re pointing out that hard work doesn’t make you exceptional, doesn’t get you rewarded and doesn’t get you ahead.
Since you apparently haven’t actually been working for the past fifteen years, the social contract has been almost entirely broken. Busting your arse gets you the same pay as the dude who takes four hour smoke breaks and a shittier quality of life due to stress.
Workers are just refusing to be exploited
Yeah there may be some smaller companies that recognise and recompense great work, but they are the exception, not the rule. And they are increasingly unicorns.
Retired a few back but keep in touch with the higher ups as well. You’re completely wrong with that statement. Many people get rewarded for hard work. But in order to get rewarded, do you have to be the one that is seriously helping the company. If you’re talking about the bottom of the worker pile then you have to do something to stand out. In my case I started off building on the factory line. Saw what they ran for computer systems. Trained myself at my own expense to learn them and ingrain to myself Socially with the people that ran them. Hard work isn’t just the physical part. It’s also the mental part and most importantly the social part. So much of business is social and if they don’t know who you are they’ll never know the hard work you’re doing or how beneficial you are to the company. If you are, that is.
If you did this today it would not work. Thats the expirence that we are living. Glad it worked for you 40yrs ago, we want the same treatment.
Nope.
I’m actually still in the workforce, so I’m gonna go ahead and consider myself to be a bit more of an authority as to what’s going on than you are, seeing as you’ve just admitted you’re divorced from the working reality.
This thread is literally full of people telling you how they have brought value - in some cases, immense, company-saving value - and not been recompensed. I very freely admitted there were some companies that did still value workers. I also said they are no longer the norm. This is a continuation of a trend that started in the 90’s when outsourcing started chewing on the arses of the white collar workers, workforces became seen as dispensable and replaceable and it has sharply increased with the sociopathy of MBAs who can’t see any further than their own personal golden parachutes.
You gained your leg up in within a business framework that no longer exists. Demanding that workers continue to play by rules their employers ignore is lunacy.
Woah retirement? What’s that? Oh right, this ancient system none of us will ever get to enjoy.
Perfect example of the defeatist attitude. Btw it’s not an ancient system. Didn’t even exist in my grandparents time. Neither did the concept of a weekend.
You guys are the majority now. Make the changes you want.
Congrats on being one of 2 generations who got to benefit off of that before it got fucked for us.
Those 2 generations fight to get that. I remember cars being burned and flipped during strikes when I was young. This generation needs to do the same. Now when people go on strike everybody hates on them. Our grandparents put their lives on the line to get pensions, weekend, overtime pay etc etc. People now are letting it all slip away. Time to stop blaming the ones that got it and start blaming the ones letting it go.
Stop spreading propaganda. No one is wasting their precious calories, helping someone else get richer.
The benefits and pay would have to be very VERY good.
That is so very far away from the actual expressed sentiment that I’m genuinely concerned that your underlying expectations of people and the world, completely hinders your ability to see reality at all.
Oh I see reality. I also see this next gen of workers coming in who are nothing like Gen X or even millennials. My underlying expectations are if you’re hired by someone be a good worker, work hard. Try to make the company better and if you’re good at it, the company will see this and promote you. Nothing crazy and nothing out of the reality that I experienced during my working life. Now I do see some new workers with the required social skills and knowledge to zoom up the ladder pretty quick, but that’s definitely not the norm.
This is not how the US workforce works at all- unless you are a boomer in a “retirement” job working 10hrs a week, getting paid for 40hrs, and relying on the younger generations to do all the work for you.
Lol. Now that’s out of touch.
Just remember those younger people who show promise actually hate you because they already do your job better than you and will never be compensated for it.
Some of them are already past me and making more. But the majority flounder and don’t last. They most definitely aren’t doing my job better than me since they had to hire 4 when I retired. 3 of them didn’t make it and have been replaced. IT security guy in case you were wondering.
Millenial here: I don’t see what for, they don’t have our best interests in mind, we should slack whenever we can, and rob them blind.
And then cry when the country falls apart because too many people are like you.
We only need like 1/3 the work I do. I’d accept slower services for the ability to touch grass.
Imagine an economy where everybody had that attitude. We would be eaten by foreign countries and then you’ll see real hardships.
it’s more that we’re tired of working hard without being rewarded. in fact, life keeps getting worse for us no matter what we do.
It takes a long time to build the skills that get the rewards. Took me decades of grinding but will with the payoff.
Dont feed the trolls folks. Or i guess don’t feed the boomers either.
Oh look another rube for the meat grinder. Skip your kids birthdays and sports games working late for the company, I’m sure they’ll understand
Or you can be a slacker, not make any money, and your kids can live in a shitty apartment in the ghetto. I’m sure they’ll understand.
That’s basically where we’re headed anyways.
I think you got to spend too much online if this is the mental attitude you have. There’s tons of opportunity and good jobs and unemployment is crazy low right now. Like I said, get yourself a skill or a trade and there’s a shit pile of money to be made and as much work as you’re willing to do. I mean it took me and most of my friends into our forties to really accumulate anything, but I feel like the people on here think they should be rich or that every boomer was rich in their thirties. That’s very bizarre and a big disconnect from the reality that it actually was for many
Or you can bust your ass and live in an apartment in the ghetto because no one wants to pay a living wage anymore.
Get a skill that pays well. Only takes a few years.
Just jump off the ladder and start over! Surely this time things will work out for you!
Went through three distinct careers in my work time. Needed to stay up with the times.
So have I. Every move has been to something that I was assured would have great pay. My current job has taken me the furthest after several promotions. It’s still not paying enough to do what I want. I’m too old to start at the bottom again on another false promise.
Yeah unfortunately once you hit a certain age your stuck as nobody will hire old guys unfortunately
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The trick is to stay in the middle like 2/3s of the pack performance wise and pick things that are highly visible to management but also not too much of a pain in the ass to “save the day” on often enough that you’re seen as reliable.
You’re hired